Home › Forums › Active Melody Guitar Lessons › How's everyone coming with EP282?
Tagged: EP280 and EP282
- This topic has 27 replies, 18 voices, and was last updated 5 years, 4 months ago by Peter A.
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November 25, 2018 at 2:38 pm #117424
The licks for this lesson are incredibly simple, but the timing is pure random chaos…almost. I find myself doing a lot of beat counting to start the licks at the right point. Like at the beginning: one two three FOUR AND ONE two three four one two three AND FOUR AND ONE two three four one two THREE AND FOUR AND one two etc etc where the licks coincide with my capital letters. I can also watch Soundslice or the tab sheets while playing the jamtrack, and that tells me where to start each lick with no strain on my brain.
I can keep about 20 or so lessons in my active memory, but I’m finding that every new lesson I memorize displaces all or part of one or more older lessons I’ve memorized. Unlike Sunburst John, it takes me a long time (a week or more) to memorize a lesson. So I’m wondering, is it worthwhile to memorize the whole thing, or would it be better to just put the tab sheets on a music stand and play it like orchestra musicians do? And I wonder, do other people also wonder about this?
This question is partly stimulated by the fact that I was just talking to a friend who is much younger than me and has been playing guitar a lot longer than I have, and he revealed to me that he only keeps 3 songs in his repertoire and just plays them over and over.
Sunjamr Steve
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November 25, 2018 at 2:53 pm #117425
Hi Steve.
I’m in a similar situation. I try to do not count beats on this, just follow the backtrack. Some of the arpegios could help on when to play the notes. SoundSlice is a bid help also to me.
Because this one seem easy, I’ve recorded the backtrak also by myself but not shure yet if finally will use my one or Brian’s one.I have a very bad memory. Normally I could only memorise 5 or 6 themes but if I have to play again a “forgotten one” it take less than the first time.
rgds
David B. -
November 25, 2018 at 3:03 pm #117426
Steve if you can remember 20 lessons I say you have a very good memory and should be very happy with that,I’m only 34 and my memory is terrible,I can play about 10 songs at a push and no more,I do a little busking in summer and play about 30 songs that I have in a binder and put on a music stand,I don’t drink but I do love to visit friends and again my guitar and binder comes along at parties so when every one gets a few beers and starts looking for me to play I just open my binder and have a jam,I wish I had a better memory but such is life.
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November 25, 2018 at 3:35 pm #117427
I find myself wondering this all the time about whether it makes any sense to memorize. I can only do or keep like one song in memory, then loose it very quickly if I don’t replay it every day. Right now I am kinda thinking I have been wasting my time trying to remember these songs of Brians because I learn them all the way which takes me several months per song then loose them much, much faster. Instead maybe I should only do improvising which I seem to do and enjoy better anyways. My problem is a special case though due to almost total short term memory loss diagnoses. One reason I have only recorded one song EP125 on here which took like 4 months to remember. Lol Been working on EP278 since it came out almost exclusively and will record it on here hopefully in the future. I get the most out of lessons such as EP199,EP273, and EP275, because they are not a song per se.
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November 25, 2018 at 4:05 pm #117428
Steve,
Your comment on memorizing kind of hit home with me. I used to have about twenty five songs that were either completely memorized or nearly so. But I used to play them several times a week to keep them fresh. I had about another five tunes that were not so far along, and they progressed slowly because I was spending most of my playing time on the ones I had memorized. I changed my focus a few years back, and these are mostly forgotten, although I occasionally revisit one and it comes back with a little work.If I take on one ofthe AM lessons, I find most of my practice time is in memorizing. Yes there can be some tricky timing passages that need work, or maybe an unfamiliar chord, but I’ll bet 80% of my is in memorizing. If the tune is fast it takes longer. I am convinced that what we perceive as limitation in our speed, really is from not having the tune memorized well enough to play at a fast tempo.
Today, I mostly don’t try to commit much to memory. I try to get where I use the tab as an aide, but have the enough of the tune under my fingers to play through it. If I get tired of playing the piece I let it go.
Bob
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November 25, 2018 at 4:59 pm #117435
Nope, not even opened the lesson yet.
..Billy..
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November 25, 2018 at 5:54 pm #117442
EP282 is deceptively hard! Had the notes mostly memorized in an afternoon but the timing is killer. Like you i’m having to tap out every measure but the whole thing goes out the window in bar 16 of the tab where you have to play 6th fret of 3rd string (C#) 4 times in a row.
Looks like the triplet in that bar goes for two beats which i didn’t even know was a thing until i tried this. lol
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November 25, 2018 at 6:48 pm #117444Anonymous
Hey Steve
As far as my repertoire goes I only have three that I’m actually really paying attention to so can’t offer any input on that.As far as 282 goes, I had no problem memorizing the tune but the timing is killing me too. Like you, I’m also finding myself counting more on this lesson than anything else I’ve ever worked on. But I think that alone is really helping my tempo and timing a lot so it’s a good trade off. I was hoping to add an extra chorus of my own but I dont think I’ll get there.
I’m not disappointed. I think this is a real pretty tune to have under my belt…and add to my repourtoire!
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November 25, 2018 at 7:28 pm #117445
I feel like I’ve got the lesson pretty much nailed down if I use the tab. By memory only I’m still spotty. I can mostly get it but occasionally I get lost. I didn’t count beats but rather used Soundslice to get the basic timing and then trying to listen more to the jam track and play what feels right. I’ve had a few sessions where I’ve thrown in some improvisation that sounded good but haven’t put much time into that yet. I’ve spent the last two days trying to figure out Reaper, but that’s a whole different post.
I’m also completely distracted by the new Boogie Woogie EP284. Love this lesson.
As far as memorization goes I’ve only got a few old lessons I can recall and play through. These are mostly lessons I learned early on when I first joined and played regularly. More recent lessons, including the monthly challenges I learn and then they seem to go out the window quickly. All lessons I work on go into a binder. Once in awhile I’ll flip back even just a month or two and try to play them. Some are familiar and start to come back. Some it seems like I’ve never even seen.
I do need to work more on practicing improvisation skills and I’m a little concerned that I don’t have a lot to show after several years here. But does it really matter? Probably not. I’m still having fun with it and it is a great way to relax after work. I’d much rather this than plop down in front of the TV for the evening.
-Doug
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November 25, 2018 at 7:37 pm #117447
Steve, just finished dinner after a having completed a retile celing job at a local restaurant.. man had thew tap beer to myself looking at my work afterwards lol.. anyway.. I really got a kick at my random with 282 ,, have a few even better than what I did here that day,,haven’t bothered with it since but came home and listened to them few takes I did..I think I remember me saying the rhythm fittted well with those Clint Eastwood kinda spaghetti flicks and remember Duffy agreeing in a sense ..so I;m going to work on where I left off but try and keep it tight and simple..but want to use the tremolo bar and pretty much the yamaha effects I used (preset) honestly wish I was ready for DAW ,, have been studying along but it simply takes time..so I will just use the bugit smartphone for this November monthly presentation. Very happy with this site and how Brian does what is best both instructional and forumwise! Sure your creativity for 282 will be a special treat as they always are!
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November 25, 2018 at 7:38 pm #117448
I like what you said Doug about “does it really matter”. That rang right through me and hit home. That helped because it really don’t. Heck I’m 61 years old and don’t ever intend to play live for anyone but my dogs and my poor wife. Lol I am having fun and that is what matters. The only other audience is not captive like my wife and dogs and would only be a recording for here, and then it can go out of my memory forever. Lol Thanks for reminding me what it’s about for some of us not intending to play out or for money. That aint gonna happen for me no matter how much I practice. Haha
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November 25, 2018 at 7:47 pm #117450
I feel like I’ve got the lesson pretty much nailed down if I use the tab. By memory only I’m still spotty. I can mostly get it but occasionally I get lost. I didn’t count beats but rather used Soundslice to get the basic timing and then trying to listen more to the jam track and play what feels right. I’ve had a few sessions where I’ve thrown in some improvisation that sounded good but haven’t put much time into that yet. I’ve spent the last two days trying to figure out Reaper, but that’s a whole different post.
I’m also completely distracted by the new Boogie Woogie EP284. Love this lesson.
As far as memorization goes I’ve only got a few old lessons I can recall and play through. These are mostly lessons I learned early on when I first joined and played regularly. More recent lessons, including the monthly challenges I learn and then they seem to go out the window quickly. All lessons I work on go into a binder. Once in awhile I’ll flip back even just a month or two and try to play them. Some are familiar and start to come back. Some it seems like I’ve never even seen.
I do need to work more on practicing improvisation skills and I’m a little concerned that I don’t have a lot to show after several years here. But does it really matter? Probably not. I’m still having fun with it and it is a great way to relax after work. I’d much rather this than plop down in front of the TV for the evening.
Doug me too.. trying yet to figure out Reaper,, I know it will take several more hours but small steps I will take because i rather just practice learning scales etc on my guitars.. I understand and appreciate all the great HELP requests for my DAW interests.. I watch the video tuturiols but still need time understanding it to use it to showcase here.
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November 25, 2018 at 8:56 pm #117457
Tip: Now that I’ve been using a DAW for several years, I’d suggest that your first goal should be to learn how to import an MP3 jamtrack into it, and then how to loop it. Or maybe you already know how to do this.
Sunjamr Steve
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November 25, 2018 at 7:59 pm #117452
I like what you said Doug about “does it really matter”. That rang right through me and hit home. That helped because it really don’t. Heck I’m 61 years old and don’t ever intend to play live for anyone but my dogs and my poor wife. Lol I am having fun and that is what matters. The only other audience is not captive like my wife and dogs and would only be a recording for here, and then it can go out of my memory forever. Lol Thanks for reminding me what it’s about for some of us not intending to play out or for money. That aint gonna happen for me no matter how much I practice. Haha
i’m 58 and learning so much here from Brian.. when I look back at how much I wasted no learning way back when to where I am now thanks to Brian and many here and elsewhere,especially YouTube! ..It was Youtube in general that brought to my attention and will to rediscover the art of playing guitar,, Now that I am getting physically older and not so kickass in to fishing hiking as much, my new foremost passion is playing my guitars instead of hooking the fish .. all good here! lol
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November 25, 2018 at 8:10 pm #117453
Haven’t really got started on the Challenge yet, but it’s definitely an inviting piece of music.
Thanks to Chargo for posting an early (and phenomenal) versions that caught my attention. Got to listen to it a few more times to get some ideas. Looking forward to the Forum members’ submissions – I think we’ll all be proud of this one.
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November 25, 2018 at 8:50 pm #117456
Thanks for all the collective pondering on this lofty subject, everyone. I think my takeaway from hearing everyone’s thoughts is this:
(1) I’m going to go buy a nice lightweight music stand and try to play more off the tabs, rather than committing every single lesson to memory. It’s like Bob said, 80% of my time has been spent just memorizing. So in the future, I’ll save my memory for building my lick library, and spend more time doing improv.
(2) I’m going to reduce the size of my permanent repertoire to maybe 10 lessons/songs. And those I will play every week or so to keep them fresh in my memory.
Sunjamr Steve
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November 25, 2018 at 9:03 pm #117458
It’s all good.. anI always make a few runs from start to finish with any lessons here or anywhere .. than I not only get the feel but learn the chords and scale progression,, from there I sit back and try improv/creativity
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November 26, 2018 at 2:18 am #117473
Hello Steve,
I think, the timing of EP282 is not as difficult as it seems. On Jamtracks are 4 Drum Beats counting-in, followed by a some confusing Beginning of the Rhythm track 1, 2, 3. The Melody begins on 4. The first I do myself with a new Song is making “cheat lists” with all important Datas (Chords, Timing ….) Attached find my timing list to EP282 with counting out each Frame (red = Melody). In Case of memorizing I have same difficulties as everyone here (Sometimes I feel I have forgotten more as ever known) Brians Lessons aren
t complete Songs or Cover Versions, but examples and inspirations for Improvisation and free Play. And therefore most important is, to analyse a new Song (used Scales, Licks …) and memorize some parts for the own Progress – not more, not less.
DieterAttachments:
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November 26, 2018 at 5:37 am #117477
Dieter,
I really like your method of highlighting the timing of the melody in red and fully intend to borrow this. One thing that struck me about this piece was the beautiful phrasing. Your template shows the tremendous variation of when Brian starts a lick in the 4 beat count. I think that’s what’s giving people difficulty.
Sometimes Brian’s tab gets a little crazy with phrases starting within a flurry of 16th notes and I have also used arrows to indicate where the beat falls.
John -
November 26, 2018 at 12:12 pm #117491
Dieter – really like your cheat sheet method. So simple, yet effective. I’m going to steal it as well.
In talking to a friend (and Active Melody member) and Dieter alludes to this as well: the point is not to memorize the piece but rather to get a take away from each lesson. By memorizing the lesson rather than just playing from tab, you are more likely to retain licks that you can use when improvising. I think that’s a good point.
-Doug
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November 26, 2018 at 1:07 pm #117499
Yes, for several years I have been doing the same thing for lessons with difficult timing. I also sometimes use a yellow marker to highlight the note that the beat falls on. And I totally agree: Rather than memorizing the whole lesson, I shall make an effort to only memorize the parts that will be useful to me for future improv.
Sunjamr Steve
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November 26, 2018 at 6:35 am #117479
Another great moody piece from Brian. I like to change the mood by playing some bits loud with a pick and some bits softly with my fingers. I prefer to play bar 13 like bar 6, I love that little lift to G major. And after bar 31, I stay up the neck and play the ending an octave higher with a resolve to F sharp, I just have to resolve it!
Jonathan Amos, Matsuyama, Japan
The farther one travels the less one knows.
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November 26, 2018 at 11:13 am #117489
I like your edited Tab Dieter, so simple but so effective. I have to say, I’m finding this timing issue ‘very’ frustrating. It’s detracting from what is a beautiful melody.
Richard
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November 26, 2018 at 4:53 pm #117519
I recorded a very rough version yesterday, lots of polishing to do yet
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November 27, 2018 at 12:09 am #117539
wonderful!
Dieter
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November 26, 2018 at 6:33 pm #117523
I really like EP280 and EP282 and practice them every night for 45 minutes. But I’m still a wanna be rookie and have difficulty. But I want give up. A little improvement every night. I have a whole winter to practice.
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November 26, 2018 at 9:55 pm #117537
Steve ,, I once remember following a lesson from “Bubblefoot/feet” forget his real name but incredibly gifted professional guitar player (shredder metal stuff) which we aren’t into but the lesson was about just this type /kind of lesson based on how to keep count within,, no ghost notes ,nothing.. he did mention he thought is was very difficult when he took the lesson.. I am tripping over the timing but this make me smile.. what really helps is getting the rhythm rolling and with the soundslice until it is thoroughly memorized before heading over to the jamtrack and doing improvisation,, the lesson is a timing lesson,, i much rather demonstrate doing the lesson right before making up stuff as I did when this came out! .. Been everywhere today practicing ..three sites and still enjoy Brian’s compact brilliant compositions! What I plan to showcase is the lesson first and wind it out with that improvisation and some cool chordal progression,, I do hear Dire Straights here as he mentioned.. little bit that tune comes to mind ,,brothers in arms..
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November 27, 2018 at 1:27 am #117542
My EP282 is coming along nicely, I think. I learned the notes pretty quickly, a few days, and thought to myself – OK so how the h… do I learn this timing? Here is what I have been doing:
1) import the MP3 into the DAW both with guitar piece and without so I can turn them on and off
2) added a click track (100 bpm). This helps me in the silent spots.
3) practice over and over playing along with Brian
4) when I think I have the timing, turn Brian’s guitar off
5) when I think I really have the timing, turn the click track off !
To my surprise, I am tapping my foot to this one, that’s new…
I’ll leave it up to you guys to be the judge of the timing when I finally post it..A few other comments:
Love to use the full minor scale (as opposed to pentatonic).
There are some very nice Mark Knopfler style licks in here, so time to practice my vibrato too.
Like Robert F said, EP280 and EP282 have become favorites that can be played over and over again.Looking forward to submission weekend !
Peter
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