Home › Forums › Guitar Techniques and General Discussions › Finger picking.
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May 27, 2020 at 8:59 am #174961
Why is this so darned difficult to do, I’ve been practising this for a full week now, nothing fancy just sticking to 3 open chords C/F/G thumb playing the root note of the chord with pointer and index playing 4th and 5th strings with a 1,2,3,4 count..
Just when I think I’m getting somewhere my fingers decide it’s time to find out what’s inside the soundhole..frustrating or what!...Billy..
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May 27, 2020 at 10:19 am #174964
I understand your frustration Billy,
If you’ve not played fingerstyle before, trying to get the fingers to do want you want can often appear a lost cause.
There are tons of videos on learning fingerstyle on YouTube of which most, are crap. Too many lessons jump straight into complex finger patterns from the outset, leaving the student bewildered and frustrated and going nowhere.I’m not sure what style you want to pursue, Travis Picking, Monotonic Thumb or Bob Dylan type folk styles, but starting from the right place is key here.
As a general principle, the Thumb will cover the low E A & D strings while the Index, Middle and Ring fingers cover G B & E. Another key principle is to anchor the palm of your right hand on or near the bridge to act as a fixed point; this might help prevent your fingers from wandering off into the sound hole etc.There are a few YT lessons worth your time, I quickly found a Marty Swartz one (Beginner Fingerpicking Guitar Lesson) which might be useful.
Most of the fingerstyle technique is about muscle-memory which takes time, patience and repartition.
I could go on, but Id better stop here, please feel free to PM me if you want any further info/adviceRichard
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September 30, 2020 at 4:57 pm #193154
Hi Richard, Ralph P. from Ohio USA. You sound like you are very experienced in fingerstyle guitar. I’ve played electric and acoustic guitar for about 50 years. For the past 3 years I’ve been learning fingerstyle on acoustic steel-string. I practice right hand technique every day and I’m making slow progress. How long should it take for muscle memory to “click” for me? I’m learning some classical pieces, Mark Hanson pieces, and some folk Travis Picking. Travis Picking seems to be the hardest. Where should I be after 3 years.
Thanks in advance,
Ralph P.Ralph P.
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May 27, 2020 at 10:24 am #174965
Sheer will, Billy.
Repeat a pattern a million times.
I find when learning a new pattern I practice it many times a day for short periods.
Sometime along the way it becomes easy. Then you start all over with another style or pattern.
Hang in there it will happen.
Ron -
May 27, 2020 at 11:51 am #174973
As a general principle, the Thumb will cover the low E A & D strings while the Index, Middle and Ring fingers cover G B & E. Another key principle is to anchor the palm of your right hand on or near the bridge to act as a fixed point; this might help prevent your fingers from wandering off into the sound hole etc.
Most of the fingerstyle technique is about muscle-memory which takes time, patience and repartition.Richard
Billy
I agree with Richard on this approach, using the thumb for strings 6,5, and 4 then using the Index, Middle and Ring fingers to cover G B & E. This is the foundation of both Travis style picking and Delta blues drone bass
Try a simple arpeggio with the C chord – thumb on the 5th string, then string 3, 2 & 1 with the index middle and ring. This a forward roll sometime called a banjo roll. Once you feel comfortable with that, play strings 2 then 3 coming back up – countless songs have used this arpeggio on piano. Add the F and G chords once you feel comfortable with it.
I don’t like to mention other instructors here but Brian doesn’t teach Travis style per se – yes it incorporated into some of his lessons so no nasty-grams please LOL – but Mark Hanson has 2 books on Travis Style picking that I learned from that really covers the subject very well and Mark is a great instructor. The Art of Contemporary Travis Picking and The Art of Solo Fingerpicking – the first book really gets the alternating bass going for the student and the 2nd book is a great intro into playing solo guitar using the alternating bass.
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May 27, 2020 at 12:16 pm #174976
Yes as stated above an anchor point on the guitar helps keep you on the right string, sometimes that’s my pinky or the heel of my palm especially if muting or even my forearm on the guitar.
Your thumb should be reasonably spaced from the fingers so that thumb and fingers are not clashingRepetition is the key even if it is just playing the six string with thumb repeatedly or muted then maybe 6 4 and bringing pointer middle ring in while watching tv.
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May 27, 2020 at 12:28 pm #174977
I feel your pain, Billy. I decided to learn a finger picking composition for this month’s challenge. There were A LOT of curse words aimed at Brian, the scapegoat for my ineptitude…ha ha ha. It felt like I was learning to play the guitar for the first time and it was soooooo frustrating! Like Ranja said it just took me time and practice to develop a new motor memory.
I also really watched my thoughts during this process. I noticed that I would get frustrated and then I would be prone to beating myself up and feeling like it was hopeless. When I noticed those thoughts I would take a moment and re-centre myself before moving on. When I was calmer, I chose not to focus on those negative thoughts and believe them. I can’t control my thoughts, they just come….and I can choose whether I want to believe them. Instead I re-focused on thoughts that lead to me feeling less frustrated and more hopeful. “Failure is not the opposite of success, it is part of it”. “EVer tried, ever failed. Fail again, fail better next time”. When I did this I noticed that little by little I was failing better, until it seemed somewhat more natural….until the next hurdle! 🙂
This mindset has been key to all of my learning here on active melody. As Henry Ford said:
“Either you believe you can, or you don’t. Either way you are right!”Good luck and keep the faith, brother!!
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May 27, 2020 at 12:49 pm #174979
I also really watched my thoughts during this process. I noticed that I would get frustrated and then I would be prone to beating myself up and feeling like it was hopeless. When I noticed those thoughts I would take a moment and re-centre myself before moving on. When I was calmer, I chose not to focus on those negative thoughts and believe them. I can’t control my thoughts, they just come….and I can choose whether I want to believe them. Instead I re-focused on thoughts that lead to me feeling less frustrated and more hopeful. “Failure is not the opposite of success, it is part of it”. “EVer tried, ever failed. Fail again, fail better next time”. When I did this I noticed that little by little I was failing better, until it seemed somewhat more natural….until the next hurdle! 🙂
This mindset has been key to all of my learning here on active melody. As Henry Ford said:
“Either you believe you can, or you don’t. Either way you are right!”Good luck and keep the faith, brother!!
A very well known online instructor that is a competitor of Brian’s has made the statement many times – to only practice something for 10-15 minutes and then walk away from it, return a few hours later and put in another 10-15 minutes on it.
I think this is great advice because is keeps down the frustration and allows enthusiasm to stay peakedThomas Edison while trying to develop the incandescent light bulb made this statement: I have not failed. I’ve just found 10,000 ways that won’t work.
Our shortcomings during the learning process is a matter of perspective. Henry Ford and Thomas Edison were great men in the area of invention and manufacturing – we hear their success stories, they saw time after time that they had to go back to square one and start over. Frustration could have stopped them in their journey but they kept their perspective in right order.Playing guitar is no different
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May 27, 2020 at 2:55 pm #174986
Thanks for all the input guys, so far for me it’s not about a style of music, it’s more about the mobility of my fingers cos sure as soon as you think about what your right hand is doing then you start to stumble, well I do.
It is frustrating as I said before but it is improving slow but sure...Billy..
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May 27, 2020 at 3:54 pm #174991
For about a year I’ve been trying to teach my granddaughter how to do some fingerstyle. The problem is, she only tries it for about 15 minutes once a week when I come over. So a year later, she’s really no better at it. When I first started learning fingerpicking, I kept a guitar handy in each of several rooms, and whenever I passed by one, I would sit down for 5 minutes and try a little fingerpicking. I did maybe 10 or more micro-sessions every day. And I learned to fingerpick in about 2 weeks.
Sunjamr Steve
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May 27, 2020 at 5:05 pm #174998
Billy its been my experience in many things and including guitar struggles that often when you are almost at the point of despair its just also close to the moment when, if you persevere things suddenly tumble into place and break through. So psychologically there are some points that you have to do a bit of battle with, and the skills will be the reward. I am betting you are close to your goal but how about trying a set piece like EP057 Chet Atkins or EP177 Bri lefty Blues and don’t bash it till you are utterly sick of it but give it plenty of regular attention and you will spot the improvements pretty soon. Take it bar by bar and when you have a few under your belt repeat them etc and add more. And you could certainly take on two lessons such as these at the same time I think. But I am a mere beginner here and I think if Richard or others of like skill throw in a countermanding comment then take that advice. some great comments to this thread.
Good Luck its worth the trouble for sure
JohnStrat -
May 27, 2020 at 6:34 pm #175002
Thanks for the input Steve and John, I’m thinking my progress after a week is going good, in the beginning I was going over my pattern for an hour or more at a time, I got to the stage where my fretting fingers were sore just touching the strings.
I think I’m close to nailing it now but as I said before just as I’m getting into the melody my fingering goes to pot.
I would love to be able to play Bri’s blues, he was a very inspirational member of AM for me, I miss him and his determination to play his guitar no matter how poorly he was..
But in all honestly I think I am quite a bit off tackling that song right now...Billy..
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May 28, 2020 at 3:59 pm #175065
Wow, an hour is way too long to be practicing fingerpicking. According to the book “The Practice of Practice”, scientific studies have shown that there’s no point in practicing more than 15 minutes, because your brain gets full and you no longer learn stuff. Of course, that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t play for more than 15 minutes. Practice is defined as trying to learn a technique or memorize a song, and playing is like noodling around just having fun.
Sunjamr Steve
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May 28, 2020 at 1:22 pm #175050
Billy, I had put the guitar down for 12 years before picking it back up last December. I was first determined to not grab a guitar pick. I had done some finger picking years ago and knew some people that never used a pick and sounded great. After a while I started using a pick occasionally just for the extra volume on my acoustic. Now I only finger pick on songs that require it. I had learned to play Malaguena years back and find this excellent practice to keep your finger picking skills honed. Lots of free lessons for Malaguena on-line. Give it a try if you get a chance.
PS. If you want to play Malaguena just like Jose Feliciano you might find it to be time intensive.
Brent
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June 23, 2020 at 1:45 am #178669
Things I find that help:
- start with simple patterns
- Use a metronome, and only go as fast as you can without mistakes, even if you need to turn the metronome off and practice super slow. Keep a record of the tempo you are up to with a pattern so you know where to start from next time.
- if a simple pattern isn’t working, isolate the movements even more. Spend a minute or 2 just doing the thumb, or the thumb and 1 finger.
- The Mark Hanson books are good, but they do move quickly in terms of complexity and tempo
- Break up your practice into smaller chunks of time spent on different things. Maybe 5 minutes working on a finger picking pattern, 3 minutes on chord changes for new chords, etc. I talk more about this type of practice in another post.
- don’t give up. Keep doing a bit every day and soon you will find yourself able to play some of the patterns (outside-in etc) on autopilot. At that point you can explore variations and more melodic approaches (the topic of Mark Hanson’s second book).
Good luck, and keep at it!
DC
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July 6, 2020 at 10:15 am #181699
I’m not sure if anyone has said this.
My advice is to rest your pinky finger on the guitar, this will keep your hand in a fixed position and stop fingers wandering around.
Hope this helps! -
July 6, 2020 at 2:28 pm #181712
Sorry gents, i honestly forgot all about this here thread.
Much the same as my finger style playing has been yet again sidelined, seems the more we delve into guitar playing the more confusing it seems to become, well certainly going by thr way some try to instruct it, I will plod on regardless but i think i will forego indtruction of those on youtube for the time being..
Thanks again to all who have taken the time out to read and respond to this thread...Billy..
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